Victory Smite Build

I don't have any math to back up my claim, but I would think the 2% DA would outweigh 4 STR even at high DA situations (it would be 15(trait)+5(merits)+4(head)+1(earring)+2(gorget)+5(legs)+3(back) = 35%)

edit: that's the last I'll say about WAR though, any more questions should be directed toward the Ukko's Fury thread.

DA procs are worth a lot less during WS than they are during TP phase. (During tp phase, a DA proc has the same damage potential as a regular hit, gives the same amount of tp. During WS, a DA hit is worth 1 ftp, the first hit of smite is worth 2.4, and has more hits than can be DA'd in a ws, so it'll never be equal to the initial hit like a DA proc can be for TP phase)

Pretty sure 2% DA in a high DA situation wouldn't even win for war, but even if it does, DA is less worth on Smite than it is Fury (smite has higher ftp)

I'm looking for suggestions for my vs build, atm this is what I use, ideas?



edit: also i'm pretty much trying to focus for an outside abyssea build

What Tiger said, that and 2%DA on an existing 33% is around a 1.5% (for reference, it's less potent than Pole grip usage was in the past) increase. If you're getting 2WSC from that STR or rather, 1WSC and 1fSTR (which doesn't autocap as many believe), it wouldn't win. Same argument can be made for head gear choices over AF3 too really.

yay math people, thanks for the corrections :)

Atis, the only thing I'd say, is I think Aethling Mantle would be better, because our attack outside isn't quite as super-man level lol

As said before, Atheling Mantle should beat any other mantle for Smite. Also, Hachiryu Haidate if you have the patience or gil, can switch the Strigoi for Epona's then too if you have.

ok so pretty much swap vigilance for atheling and strigoi for epona's. Guess it's time to go for those sarameyas lol

Might want to consider an ire torque +1 as well for outside aby.

Lets go Cruor farm.

For the waist, wouldn't Bier(+1) be detrimental to V.Smite because Dex affects crit rate? Why wouldn't pipilaka belt be a viable choice?

In abyssea in particular, the -DEX will do nothing because your crit hit rate from dex will be capped regardless.

Ok, so if I got this right, ideally (I'm leaning toward what Entourage said):



Looks like pyrosoul and rancor collar are 700-800k each on Siren, and cursed kabuto -1 is pretty rare, last one sold a couple weeks back for 3 mil. I'm probably going to stick to black belt until I get the new STR+8/DA+2% belt, going to kill Odin and get aesir until I finish WotG and go with attack+4/TP bonus +25 on moonshade, and I might finish usukane legs until I can afford hachiryu haidate (I really hope they release something better in the update). Also, aias bonnet might be a temporary fix until I come across a cursed kabuto -1.

P.S. I'll have to pick up an ire torque +1 for voidwatch/other stuff outside abyssea.

Is Ire torque +1 really better than rancor vs voidwatch? >_>
Crit rate +5 is still damn hot outside of abyssea.
Also, vs VW, you probably want some acc, and rancor provides that aswell.

Woah, wondering how this will fare when the update is out Monday.

(Neck) Rare
DEF:10 STR+4 Attack+15 Slow+5%
Lv. 92 MNK THF DRK BST SAM DRG DNC

Possible alternative to ire+1 and rancor collar?

What about outside? The extra 12-13 Dex of Pipilaka vs Bier(+1) should result in at least 3% crit rate, if not more if you have higher Dex.

that neck will be used outside abyssea yea - 3 STR vs ~13 attack. never use beir+1 outside, it's a pure abyssea piece.

What would be better outside then? pipilaka belt? anguinus belt? etc?

Anguinus belt, unless you're within the 40-50ddex range. Anguinus belt really deserves more credit than it gets as a belt piece. Sure Beir +1 is better at times, but the increase that beir+1 has over anguinus when its better is really small vs the increase that anguinus has when its better than beir +1 which is much larger.

Also Ire +1 torque is only for impetus up inside abyssea after a straight 10-115tp round of none misses+ws and your new tp cycle begins. Rancor outside always. You dont get any fstr with Ire torque +1 outside because your most likely already capped with vere's +15 str and tantra +12 not to meantion legs/rings/head etc...

I am by no means a math wizard when it comes to this game. If anyone has concrete numbers that reach a different outcome then my own, I will gladly alter/remove this info. Technically this is all theoretical reasoning. Regardless...

Here is my thought process:

1.) The best VS set for any particular situation is the one that gives the highest average returns.
2.) If we maximize our damage potential across a number of smites in a particular situation we will receive the highest average.
3.) Because VS is a crit based WS, it would be very effective to raise our crit hit rate in order to generate the highest damage, and thus, highest average.
4.) Our crit rate is directly related to a full crit on VS, and full crits maximize damage.

Lets look at an abyssea example using collar versus torque as our neck WS piece, assuming a couple constraints for experiments sake:

- substantial impetus boost
- capped accuracy
- a very high crit hit rate using torque which is = 85%
- our crit hit rate when incorporating the collar into our VS set is = 90%
- our other smite gear is very good (no fSTR or attack deficiencies)

Chance of full crit on VS with torque=
.85*.85*.85*.85 = 52.2%

Chance of full crit on VS with collar=
.9*.9*.9*.9 = 65.6%

- While using a collar for VS we realize a 13.4% greater chance to see a full crit. This percentage difference becomes higher when operating even closer to the critical hit cap, as well as triple or double attacking during VS.
- Under these conditions, collar > torque inside abyssea.


Lets look at the same example, but this time outside of abyssea, assuming these constraints:

- impetus boost
- capped accuracy
- crit hit rate with torque = 25%
- crit hit rate with collar = 30%
- other VS gear same as first example

Chance of full crit on VS with torque=
.25*.25*.25*.25 = .4%

Chance of full crit on VS with collar=
.3*.3*.3*.3 = .8%

- Because of the severely diminished critical hit rate outside of abyssea, the collar does almost nothing to boost the probability of a full crit on VS.
- Under these conditions torque > collar. Thus, answering your VW question.

Some other considerations:

1.) If our crit hit rate is capped before utilizing collar, ire torque will quite obviously win for damage.
2.) The abyssea example did not incorporate crit hit damage+ which would in turn provide the collar with an even greater advantage on damage output at high crit hit rate percentages.
3.) The collar becomes less attractive with impetus down in all cases (40% of the time).


This is a very good point, if you are uncapped on accuracy I would think that collar would take the lead. If you are REALLY hurting for accuracy I would think there is even a better option than collar.

For all the cases I described, these numbers pretty much go out the window when you aren't capping accuracy.

I think I'm going to go with this set for now (inside abyssea, MNK/WAR with RR/GH/SS):



I'll be upgrading aias to maybe shura kabuto +1 with WS dmg +3% if possible (attack+ would be a bonus), and legs with hachiryu haidate, gil permitting. Also waiting on the STR+8 double attack+3% to upgrade from black belt. Rancor collar seems to be too situational/minimal difference to spend the gil on/carry an extra item around.

Why are you not using Apoc?

People that dont use apoc remind me of the people that used str over haste, cause hitting harder is better than hitting faster.

I won't have any use for auto-reraise with my WHM friend around, and MNK/WAR has no use for quick magic, so I'd be sacrificing triple attack+15% for counter+10%, crit rate +20%, and AGI+50. I'll mostly be tanking so GH might be a bit better for me, and I'm still testing gear combos/atma combos. If I notice dmg going down a lot, I'll go back to SS/RR/Apoc.

I'd ditch SS before GH personally...

Then you'd lose crit damage+30%, and I thought VS was crit-based?

Tanked Raja's in grauberg a few weeks back. 1 MNK dd with 85 empy with 2 whms curing. Apoc, SS, RR. (easy as pie) But in all seriousness Id rather lose Apoc instead of SS or RR. But Id rather take apoc over GH if its a straight up "kill it before it resists the crap out of me" fight.

Just use those and punch stuff in the FACE! Now go!

idk what the base crit rate for VS is, as I'm not a mnk, but I would have thought 20% crit rate would have been pretty tasty for dot and ws damage.

That's what I'm saying, SS/RR/GH, and ditch apoc. Still testing it all though.